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Author Topic: Nofap  (Read 13845 times)  Share 

Rain

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #30 on: December 12, 2011, 01:19:06 PM »
I never tried to go too deep into neurochemistry. I've read about the chemicals but I'm lousy at memorizing and recalling what chemicals does what.

As a virgin and trying to get out from an out of touch with reality framework I see great benefit with being able to let go of porn and masturbating. The thing is, I noticed these last few days that I wasn't just addicted to porn (I got a lot of sexual fantasies, and I urged myself to check a pornsite for just another video) - but even more, I started feeling a general and unsettling discomfort from not having released.

"My mind actually thinks I want to release to women that do not exist, to fantasies that are not happening." For any sane person, that should just not be okay. (FYI: I've been masturbating 3-5x a week since I learned about it, never actually considered that there were negatives.)

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #30 on: December 12, 2011, 01:19:06 PM »

neither21

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #31 on: December 12, 2011, 03:28:30 PM »
Quote
I see anything which puts us more in touch with our real-world sensory experience [as a positive thing].


great quote!

Illuminatus

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #32 on: December 12, 2011, 03:44:52 PM »
I never tried to go too deep into neurochemistry. I've read about the chemicals but I'm lousy at memorizing and recalling what chemicals does what.

As a virgin and trying to get out from an out of touch with reality framework I see great benefit with being able to let go of porn and masturbating. The thing is, I noticed these last few days that I wasn't just addicted to porn (I got a lot of sexual fantasies, and I urged myself to check a pornsite for just another video) - but even more, I started feeling a general and unsettling discomfort from not having released.

"My mind actually thinks I want to release to women that do not exist, to fantasies that are not happening." For any sane person, that should just not be okay. (FYI: I've been masturbating 3-5x a week since I learned about it, never actually considered that there were negatives.)

I had a similar attachment to fantasy, and in a way it also fuelled my addiction to porn.

The thing about fantasy is that you can make it as powerful as you like, and condition yourself to release more and more dopamine each time when creating them. It creates a positive feedback loop. Excess dopamine causes sexual fetish, which causes more dopamine. (I am not the only person to posit that excess dopamine causes fetishism; Google it).

The truth however is that the real-world version of the fantasy is nowhere near as mind-blowing as the imagined version. So actually doing some of your fantasies is a pretty good way to get over them (stick to the legal ones, please).

But for me, the only time I've truly ended the cycle of fantasy and masturbation has been by spending the last 3 months with a real woman, and not masturbating when she's not around. So both the habit and the psychological aspect have been broken.

If I sit down in front of porn now, I literally feel like I don't know what to do. I don't know why I'm sat looking at naked people I've never met on a screen. The whole thing seems completely ridiculous to me.

Getting back in touch with the real world in as many areas of your life as possible is the healthiest thing you can do IMO. You might have noticed I haven't been posting very much the last few weeks, and that some long posts I was going to write have gone unwritten. Well that's because I'd literally rather just walk around in the town centre. Or go to the gym. I derive pleasure whenever I am out there existing in the real world -- having a sensory experience rather than an intellectual one.

neither21

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #33 on: December 17, 2011, 07:48:32 PM »
UPDATES?

I'm converting my real life friends.

I fapped for the first time in six weeks last night. don't feel bad about it. except i watched porn, which i've been telling myself not to do. whatevs! i still feel energetic and confident and sexual

Nero

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #34 on: December 18, 2011, 06:41:14 PM »
Hey!

So far I haven’t cut completely on the fapping, but I have reduced it to less than once a week. I have had sex twice since then and I have to say, although the urge to speed up and cum was bigger than usual but, I managed to last as long I normally would. I always felt more dominant and horny which made sex great.
Another thing that used to happen to me whenever I didn’t cum for more than a week were nocturne ejaculations. So far it hasn’t happened, fortunately. 

Rain

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #35 on: January 02, 2012, 08:24:09 AM »
No, I haven't really gotten this to become a permanent lifestyle change. I went one week at most, and it's something I am planning on continuing. Beyond that, I will not make any promises to myself. If anything, holding about a week means one fantastic release, and it does help with testosterone levels. That, I welcome.

Mihawk

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #36 on: January 10, 2012, 05:28:18 AM »
Having played around with minimizing fapping a few months ago and somewhat succeeding I can share my experience on the matter.

Attitude towards this whole thing is the most important aspect.. If I did this to become X or Y I would ALWAYS be dissapointed because fantasy about the future will never match up to reality or worse I'd delude myself thinking I have actually made some progress.

Playing with no-fap became such a big issue for me I had to completely change my approach to it. While it is true that you are more energetic when you haven't released for a long time, it doesn't mean you are drained or weak when you eventually do release. Well, except for perhaps the very next day. If you are going to the gym you know what I mean.

My point is that I had built up this whole idea where I viewed myself as fully charged when I hadn't fapped for say 2 weeks, and   drained and fatigued for 4-5 days after fapping, I always had this creeping thought "Oh I fapped 4 days ago, I'm weak now". I would also imagine that I'm macho and radiant when on 2 weeks. See how ridiculous this is?

I understood that I have to stop forcing this change, because it's impossible. This doesn't mean it's futile, and that you can instead keep on fapping for eternity. That's also forcing a certain framework on reality. Fapping also suddenly got this "forbidden fruit" quality, where I would always have it in the back of my mind, desiring it.

What you resist persists.. this is so true when it comes to.. well everything, but especially masturbation.

My tip is fap when you feel like it.. when not feeling like it, don't. Put attention on something else, but don't force it.

Sexual energy is the same as creative energy. Get a habit of doing something which is not pre-meditated and without rules. You could get a pack of crayons and PLAY with them for just five minutes each day, and see what happens. Your attention will naturally move to more creative endeavors. Remember when you were a kid and you played with some toys? This is the kind of PLAY I'm talking about. Not "Ok Now I'm going to play with crayons for 5 minutes so I can transform sexual energy into creative energy and become the worlds greatest whatever". Play is when you do whatever you are doing only for the sake of doing just that!! There are no musts or should's involved.

If you have forgotten how to play like a child, I highly suggest a dose of >125 mg pure MDMA.

Nowadays I average 1 fap per week. Sometimes I realize I have reached 2 weeks without even trying. A year ago I was doing perhaps 3-4 times each week. Porn is not very interesting anymore, I find fapping in the shower to the sensations of this erotic play to be more fun.

Illuminatus

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #37 on: January 10, 2012, 07:13:36 AM »
Mihawk has made some great points here.

I have taken a step back from this thread and let it play out. This was mainly because of the following:

Attitude towards this whole thing is the most important aspect.. If I did this to become X or Y I would ALWAYS be dissapointed because fantasy about the future will never match up to reality or worse I'd delude myself thinking I have actually made some progress.

Basically, as long as you guys think it's causing great things to happen, it is.

But the other side to this double-edged sword is the assumption of weakness once you DO masturbate, which can be just as powerful:

Quote
My point is that I had built up this whole idea where I viewed myself as fully charged when I hadn't fapped for say 2 weeks, and   drained and fatigued for 4-5 days after fapping, I always had this creeping thought "Oh I fapped 4 days ago, I'm weak now".

That is the double-edged sword in all belief systems based on ritual. It especially applies to things like drugs. "I can do whatever I want when I'm on my tramadol!"...
"Oh no, I've run out of tramadol!". Or even worse: "Oh no, the tramadol isn't working any more!"

The point is that whatever change did occur (if any at all), the human brain has this tendency to magnify this change x100 by putting all its focus and awareness into it, and more importantly by assuming X, Y and Z are all connected to the change, even when they're not: "I talked to more women this week. It must be the no fapping!"
Maybe there is some grain of truth to it. But the mind, no doubt, is creating a massive percentage of this effect.

Now, in my experience, fapping or no fapping only really matters in relation to one thing: exercise. If I want to exercise, but I fap, then I simply won't want to exercise any more. If I try and exercise anyway, it will take me a really long time to get into it properly, if at all. So my own rule regarding fapping is: never, ever do it before exercise, because it destroys exercise.

Regarding sex drive, I find that fapping does not diminish my urge for another orgasm. In fact, sometimes, it increases it. Then I just end up fapping all day.

What matters more to me than fapping in this regard is actual sex. If I have not had sex with a real woman for 2 weeks (this seems to be the key time period, I have found) then I will start thinking about women all the time. Fapping or not fapping simply won't affect this either way. I will think about women until I've had sex with a real woman. If I fap 10 times, I will still think about women.

So to me, fapping is pretty much unconnected to wanting a real woman. Maybe there is a problem if you end up installing porn in your mind as your "actual release", because then you will never break the cycle of compulsive fapping until you install "real women" as your "actual release".

So in my view, not fapping to break the cycle of porn addiction is a good idea, but ONLY if you do install "real women" in its place. This is simply because sex with real women does provide satisfaction in ways fapping on its own does not. There is definitely some different mix of neurochemicals released when you have sex with a real woman. Maybe it's oxytocin from the touch, and maybe some other things too, but your brain somehow "knows" when it has had real sex or not, and I know I can be satisfied for a long time after having real sex.

Quote
Sexual energy is the same as creative energy. Get a habit of doing something which is not pre-meditated and without rules. You could get a pack of crayons and PLAY with them for just five minutes each day, and see what happens. Your attention will naturally move to more creative endeavors. Remember when you were a kid and you played with some toys? This is the kind of PLAY I'm talking about. Not "Ok Now I'm going to play with crayons for 5 minutes so I can transform sexual energy into creative energy and become the worlds greatest whatever". Play is when you do whatever you are doing only for the sake of doing just that!! There are no musts or should's involved.

I think there is a link between sex and creativity, but it's more to do with lack of sex = actually making a creative output.

E.g. if I am having sex, and then do some creative work for my job, the work is still just as creative as if I had not had sex.

However, if I am having sex, and then there is some creative work which I am not deadlined for, it simply won't get done. For example, I wrote a hell of a lot more posts over Christmas while I was apart from my girlfriend for 2 weeks. I wrote my book while she was away, too. I have enough materials to write another couple of books now, but as long as I'm living with my girlfriend, it most likely won't get done.

And that, in my opinion, is the link between sex and tendency for creative output (rather than "creativity").
« Last Edit: January 10, 2012, 07:16:24 AM by Illuminatus »

moviestar

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #38 on: January 14, 2012, 03:58:47 PM »
Creativity comes from sexual frustration, it does not relate to orgasms.

X2F01

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #39 on: September 12, 2012, 07:36:47 PM »
That is the double-edged sword in all belief systems based on ritual. It especially applies to things like drugs. "I can do whatever I want when I'm on my tramadol!"...
"Oh no, I've run out of tramadol!". Or even worse: "Oh no, the tramadol isn't working any more!"

The point is that whatever change did occur (if any at all), the human brain has this tendency to magnify this change x100 by putting all its focus and awareness into it, and more importantly by assuming X, Y and Z are all connected to the change, even when they're not: "I talked to more women this week. It must be the no fapping!"
Maybe there is some grain of truth to it. But the mind, no doubt, is creating a massive percentage of this effect.

I think that this is an easy way for someone to convince himself that porn isn't that big of a deal as I have done (quitting masturbating won't help me since it is just the belief about the positive effects of nofap that help rather than the actual neurochemistry). While I understand the point and see how some people might be guilty of this, I feel like people in more extreme situations stand to gain a lot. Granted, this is slightly speculative since I have not "gotten better" from nofap in any qualitative way after the two weeks or so that I have done it.

In the two weeks that I have not masturbated, I have got two erections the entire time. Even during those times, I felt strikingly little compulsion to seek sexual gratification. I have been excited by the idea of "sexual success" in the ego sense when I came across girls who liked me, but I didn't actually "want" to fuck them. In fact, I feel that I have never had the feeling of actually wanting to fuck someone just for the sake of it. To put it more succinctly, I feel like I have never "sexually imprinted" on human beings in general. I attribute this to my porn habits rather than something else because, after two weeks, I literally had a wet dream where I was sitting on a couch watching porn on a computer. It was pretty pathetic to be honest. At least I know that I will have the motivation not to masturbate for a while, which actually doesn't sound hard at all since I have not been horny ever, really. I have always tended to make the deliberate choice to watch porn as a response to boredom rather than for pleasure or horniness.

I suppose that Illuminatus' advice makes sense to me if it is given to the average person rather than someone who's only successful (as in resulting in orgasm) sexual experiences have been through porn. I am optimistic that nofap will help me.

Illuminatus

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #40 on: September 13, 2012, 04:27:12 AM »
I have been excited by the idea of "sexual success" in the ego sense when I came across girls who liked me, but I didn't actually "want" to fuck them. In fact, I feel that I have never had the feeling of actually wanting to fuck someone just for the sake of it. To put it more succinctly, I feel like I have never "sexually imprinted" on human beings in general.

Dude, I covered sexual imprinting in one of my recent PMs to you. Please re-read it. It set out the likely parameters required to create a sexual imprint. It's nothing to do with porn use.

AJM

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #41 on: September 13, 2012, 08:20:46 AM »
I have been excited by the idea of "sexual success" in the ego sense when I came across girls who liked me, but I didn't actually "want" to fuck them. In fact, I feel that I have never had the feeling of actually wanting to fuck someone just for the sake of it. To put it more succinctly, I feel like I have never "sexually imprinted" on human beings in general.

Dude, I covered sexual imprinting in one of my recent PMs to you. Please re-read it. It set out the likely parameters required to create a sexual imprint. It's nothing to do with porn use.

I have quite an interest into this topic as well. Any possibility you would flesh out a separate post about it? Or perhaps you have already discussed this somewhere else?

Illuminatus

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #42 on: September 13, 2012, 11:50:46 AM »
I have quite an interest into this topic as well. Any possibility you would flesh out a separate post about it? Or perhaps you have already discussed this somewhere else?

It's simple, so I'll summarize it here.

Firstly a "sexual imprint", in this post, means the moment in your life when you change from being just "interested" in girls (mainly for ego/status reasons), to becoming powerfully drawn towards girls, and feeling inclined to be chasing them literally all the time (primarily for sexual/female energy reasons).

Here are the elements required to create a sexual imprint, from my own experience.

- She must be very desirable to you. So if society says she's hot but she doesn't make your dick twitch and your balls hurt when you are talking to her in person, then fucking her will be lacklustre for you and will not create a sexual imprint. Even after fucking several average girls, you likely still won't feel this draw, going forward. She must be very desirable to you.

- You must do the whole seduction yourself, from start to finish. Having sex with her must come as a result of your own actions. So fucking a prostitute, for example, comes as a result of your paying her money, not as a result of your seducing her. Your brain will know the difference.
If the seduction comes as a result of your noticing a girl is already interested in you, or even if she approaches you first, as long as you then do what's necessary to make sex happen, that still counts. So we are simply talking about you and a girl getting together through mutual attraction.
This point is mainly for guys who have only fucked prostitutes and are now wondering why they're still not inclined to chase girls very much. It's because a prostitute fucked your money, not you, and your brain does know the difference.

- Fuck her without a condom. This is not a guide to proper condom use, and that requires its own post. Obviously you all know the risks, especially regarding a girl you do not know much about. This is just an observation, from my own personal experience, that a sexual imprint will only form once you fuck a girl you very much desire, whom you seduced yourself (or at least drove it to the finish line), with no condom.

This is obviously how the majority of human sexual encounters arise anyway, and always have done, and most non-community people would find it highly strange that we even had to make this list. But we did, and we have, so let's all now try and get on with our lives. :P
« Last Edit: September 13, 2012, 12:03:43 PM by Illuminatus »

AJM

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Re: Nofap
« Reply #43 on: September 15, 2012, 07:10:07 AM »
I have done quite a bit of nofap myself so I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents.

I've fapped around 4-5 times in the past 6 months and there was a period where I didn't fap for 3 and a half months. Last weekend I fapped twice.
This week I've been a lot more tired then in the previous weeks and had quite low motivation to get out of the house as well.
So in my experience motivation and energy are two main factors you get out of nofap and some more desire for real women as well.
When I stop fapping these conditions improve until end of week 3 and after that it kind of plateous. There is a boost of confidence around that 3 week mark which then fades later on.

Regarding the plasebo effect I estimate that for me it's around 50/50. Actually gaining energy and motivation to do things, get out of the house and socialize with people and then because you think you are feelings awesome and can do anything you get some extra boost out of that well. So it's not so much nofap in itself, but the combination of gained energy and motivation + what you do with that equals the results you get.


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